We made the default 'dotted' pattern to be equal on/off. There is just no way to have a line of ~1px width, square marks, and 50/50 on/off that does not blend into a solid line.

Maybe I was not clear: what I meant was simply that with the lw clipping threshold of lw=2, then the dots were elongated since their aspect ratio was (2×1.1=)2.2 × 1.5, while with a threshold ≤ 1.5, they are almost real squares: (1.5×1.1=)1.65 × 1.5. So I think adopting a lw clipping threshold below 1.5 is a good thing for this reason: one gets (almost) “dots” when asking fordotted line style with default lw value. Besides one gets a significantly better approximation of “dots” with lw=0.8 in the case of grid lines if the lw clipping threshold is set equal to 1 (aspect ratio is then (1×1.1=)1.1 × 0.8), than with this threshold being 2.

About the problem raised in#7991 , it is more focused on the case of grid lines, which are a “subset” of lines. I think that#8040 may be a suitable solution for every body. Most user will not bother tweaking grid lines and will rely on the new solid line style introduced with mpl 2.0, while the ones who prefer the old style will be able to adapt it in rcParams.

Looking at the boxplot replacement (the first image file that is changed) shows why the threshold was set the way it was: the dots in the new version are so small that I don't think they are very functional, while the old version was highly functional.

@efiring It may have been functional. It wasnot a dotted line. I'd be ok changing to a dashed style to keep the same aesthetic appearance.

If you want to go for linguistic purity over graphical functionality, why have a threshold at all?

Maybe the threshold should be applied to the spacing, not to the dots?

It's not "linguistic purity"--it's called not confusing or surprising our users. I'm not interested in semantic arguments--If I ask for a dotted line, I don't expect to see a dashed line. What matplotlib was displaying before was definitively "dashed", and it's the kind of thing that leads people to lose time wondering why matplotlib insisted on dashes when they asked for dotted.

The new behavior, while visually less pleasing, at least gives the user what they asked for and leads to the path of "that's too small, maybe I should use a thicker line".

Here are some example images, all at 300 DPI.

importmatplotlib.pyplotaspltfig,ax=plt.subplots()ax.grid(linestyle='dotted')fig.savefig('test.png',dpi=300)

Minimum 2.0:

Minimum 1.0:

Minimum 0.5:

Make sure before judging that you view the full-size version, since your browser/github will be scaling the inline versions.

And if I go to 600 DPI and turn off the linewidth threshold, I can get 0.25 linewidth to look fine dotted and can even make out individual dots at a linewidth of 0.1.

I agree that having a “dotted” line style that is more “short-dashed” than dotted appears to be rather confusing: they are several issue tickets that noticed it (and we are only talking of the people coming to GitHub).

On the other hand, it is true that the threshold of lw=1 seems to be more or less the boundary between “kind of functional” and “not so functional“ with the defaults (but it is also DPI-dependent, so…).

The idea of having some kind of threshold applied only to the off ink parts like@efiring suggested (if I understood correctly) is something that I was thinking about too, and I think it would be worth trying it. Nevertheless, we may want to be extra careful with all the “intelligence” we put in this scaling because:

1. it may lose the user;
2. can it be easily worked around? For example, can I, and would it be difficult to get a line with a (0.5, 10, 10, 0.5)-pt pattern style and a width of 0.5 pt,if this is what I really want?

Please note that these two remarks already apply with the current scaling ;)…

IMO, given:

1. "useful" linewidth depends on the DPI
2. Matplotlib is known for publication quality, which means figures at at least 300 DPI

We should not be thresholding the linewidth for scaling the dash/dot pattern. Provide sane defaults, but don't stand in the way of giving the user what they want--and right now, the library stands in the way. Here's the closest I can get to a thin dotted line at 300 DPI on current master:

That's downright silly.

I am convinced, will get this fixed some time tonight (will probably get to my destination before the tests finish running on my laptop to get update the images).

Would there be an interest to implement something inspired by what@rougier suggested in#7087, i.e. adding a few new named line styles? I am especially thinking about “loose” versions of the current non solid styles (e.g. "--:loose" or "dotted:loose" for a pattern like (1.1, 3.3) instead of (1.1, 1.1)). This way, we could provide “sane” defaults for people who do not (want to) know what values to use in order to get less dense dashed or dotted line styles.

I would be happy to give it a shot in a separate PR if somebody thinks that it would be worth it (or at least nice trying ;) ).

Edit: I opened a separate PR (#8048) to demonstrate what I have in mind about supplementary line styles to easily get “loosely dashed lines”.

Just a thought. If one removes the line width-controlled dash scaling, then all the non solid patterns with the default lw = 1.5 are changed (as previously the scaling threshold wasmax(2.0, lw)), aren't they? If it is actually true, does it means that one should scale the former on-off sequences in the rcParams (by a factor × 2/1.5) to keep a consistent behavior?

If we change the patterns or the scaling factor, then we change everything else.

@dopplershift convinced me that the clipping was a mistake to begin with and we should take this chance to get get rid of it (which means this needs a bunch of docs added).

I agree with getting rid of the clipping, for the reasons@dopplershift explained. I was simply concerned that we could change the default pattern, as itis/was impacted by the clipping (default lw is 1.5 and clipping threshold was 2), without noticing it. If I am correct, such a change does not really get tested within our test suite as most of the examples (i.e. all of them but the four ones that you updated) use the “classic” style, don't they?

Anyway, could this be talked about during the next Monday phone call? I think this is something that definitively needs careful attention as it will impact most of the graphs. By the way, I think that the ideas in#8040 (that makes possible to globally fine tune the grid line style) and in#8048 (that introduces new (“loose”) line styles, besides the current ones) may be solutions to help the users that would “suffer” from the removing of the clipping. But I guess I am biaised here ;).

Edit:meeting <- phone call

Some image tests do not seem happy with the new version of the dash patterns ^^.

@dopplershift This should be ready to go as we discussed on Monday.

@afvincent Can you approve/merge since things have changed significantly since your initial approval?

LGTM.

BTW@tacaswell , thanks for taking care of this PR :).

@tacaswell I just realized it now, but shouldn't this change be documented in anapi_changes or awhats_new entry?

In should!