Talk:Tuatha Dé Danann
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Why is this article relying on an American for a translation of simple to understand Irish? Why is any citation, here, needed at all? One doesn't need a citation to establish the meaning of the English words "John's hat", or the Spanish equivalent of the aforementioned.
Dé is, as can be clearly seen, a capitalised, proper noun. It should be translated as such. Why is it not capitalised (Wikipedia follows normal rules of grammar etc.).
Dé is the possessive, genitiveform of "Dia", in English, "God". That is to say it means "God's", and nothing else, most certainly not "gods" (with is neither singulsr nor genitive).
To imply Dé is the plural form of god is deceptive nonsense.
To imply Dé means "goddess" is also deceptive nonsense. Goddess would also be "dia" with the prefix "ban" for woman. It doesn't say bandia.
To then imply Dé means both plural "gods" and singular "goddess" simultaneously is beyond ridiculous.
Dé means "God's" and nothing other than this, in the past and present time.
"Tuath" means country or kingdom as well as the people of the country, a designation one in the same. This should be clearly explained in the initial translation. "Tuatha" may refer specifically to the "people" of the Tuath, in this context ("people" by the very nature of the word implies a plurality of human beings without need for the "s" affix. To imply it means "peoples" would imply "more than one race" and this, once again, is not what is communicated. It is another error.
Also, there are no prepositions such as [tribe] "of the" [goddess Danaan]. We can't just invent and insert non-existant prepositions (even if deceptive mistranslators have done, to fit an even greater mistranslation). They must be removed as false.
"Tuatha Dé" is "God's people", Tuatha Dé is "God's kingdom" or "God's country", where God's people dwell. Simples.
If arguing, with respect to the late scribal addition "Danaan", altered once Christianity was universally accepted across Europe, is part of the genitive (possessive) noun "God's..." then the English should be Danaan God's People.
To argue Tuatha Dé is "people of gods" or "tribe of gods" is pure nonsense, due to a deceptive withdrawal of the apostrophe. Should one wish the words to go in that order that is fine, as "people of God's." or "tribe of God's", but this not natural in English, where the genitive proper noun comes first giving 'God's people" or "God's tribe".
The deity refered to is the great God, the Lord Almighty, as was in beginning, now and ever shall be. People just buy into this garbled, pantheonic nonsense as they lack understanding of the structure...
Ok. Very fair points. Thanks for explanation. I thought my paragraphs were deleted at first. It's only a quick opinion here, but to quote a phrase from the 'good book', some take "their refuge, the lie". The custodians who descend from the former authors in the "primordial tongue" allow it. I surmise there are good (and likely ethical) reasons to allow this, and to let the general public misapprehend the subject, even to the point of completely inaccurate translations of the very most simple, essential terms such as "God's". I don't really see why a non-native "Celticist" has to be prioritised over a simple dictionary with respect to such keywords and phrases. I do not believe the word "De" has evolved much at all over this long period referred to here. Most certainly it will not have "mutated" from meaning "God's" to "gods" or vice versa. I could find examples in the Irish throughout all periods in which these stories of TDD were recorded and De (with a fada) will remain the same. Would be interesting to establish where the error was first introduced into English translations (it may've been a simple error, the apostrophe being dropped from "God's" with the simple error then persisting. Ireland had to rewrite key elements of herself, we must be seen to have received "knowledge of the true one God" from the representative of the apostle Paul the Holy Father of the Roman Church. So Patrick is seen to bring it all. "Here Patrick, take these books and pass them back to us pretending they're yours."
Can we have the genealogy chart fixed so it is readable? I am a genealogist and even I can't make sense of this chart. A row of vertical lines that go no where is of no use to anyone who wants to understand the mythology.
I've never understood how Danann could be about a goddess called Danu since the suffix of -ann is pluralisation, not possession.So if you say Danu owns something, you wouldn't say "danann", you'd say "(Gaelic word for object) Danu"Danann probably is pluralisation of Dia, meaning god. It's never made sense to mean Danu.Tuatha danann would mean "tribe belonging to gods" whereas the dé, i believe, makes it so that it means "tribe of gods" (Collectively, meaning the members of the tribe are gods)Oo432 (talk)20:55, 26 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]
It is amazing how sometimes scientists make bold assumptions in comparative mythology, and that the Hindu Danu is the same Irish Danu is denied (Indo-European mythology exist). Tuatha De Danann = Danavas, whom Indra expelled from Svarga (which corresponds to the assumption that they are fallen angels)
There is Aos Si aka Aes Sídhe/Side/Daoine Sìth which is connected with parallel space and again we open Indian myths and meet the term Siddha and Siddhashrama. Siddhashrama was connected with Shambhala, parallel space/underworld and and unusual creatures and people who had unusual abilities which corresponds to the Tuatha de DanannAwyachin (talk)12:28, 25 August 2025 (UTC)[reply]
Mark Williams in his book Ireland's Immortals discusses the translation of Danann being a genitive of "Danu." He concludes that this was an mistaken interpretation, and that it was originally related to "dán" meaning "craft/skill." This would make Tuatha Dé Danann "The Tribe of the God of Craft." Given there is no attribution to Danu, and Danann in only mentioned once in LGE, this really seems to be a mistranslation. Recent scholarship has embraced this interpretation of the name. I believe it is only right to give both translation options at the start of the article.Taylor Lane (talk)08:49, 22 September 2025 (UTC)[reply]
