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This is per official Wikipedia policy atWP:NAME#Avoid the definite article ("the") and the indefinite article ("a"/"an") at the beginning of the page name. --Tenebrae (talk)18:55, 3 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

As perThe Shadow, can this be moved back toThe Avenger, please? Capitalization of "The" sets the character in the same category as The Shadow, and not the Flash, the Joker, etc.ntnon (talk)21:44, 6 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]

The Shadow, after much debate and consensus, refers to the franchise of radio dramas, pulp stories, comics, etc., and not to the character per se.

Not sure what "category" you're referring to, but this was part of what the Shadow debate entailed — that fans of different characters would all want their character referred to as The Spirit, The Phantom, The Hulk, etc. --Tenebrae (talk)23:56, 12 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Reading through the The Shadow naming debate, I thought the major point over the The/[null] leader was whether the character was regularly referred to using a capitalized "T"he, and thus whether it was part of the official name/title. "The Shadow" is the phrase - with a capital "T" - henceThe Shadow. The Avenger is the same, hence... (that was what I meant by "category," it probably should have been "bracket").

So: the Joker, the Flash, (the) Batman, the Hulk. The Phantom and t/The Spirit are a little more tricky, because both seem to be referred to interchangeably with similar regularity. However, it's pretty standard across a number of books to see The Shadow and The Avenger.ntnon (talk)02:46, 14 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]

On the basis of the above discussion I've moved the page back to "The Avenger" until we develop a consensus for a move. I've looked atThe Shadow andThe Phantom and the both utilise "The" in the name, as doesThe Simpsons. The key, according to the MOS is if,by convention it is an inseparable part of a name. I've run a google book search and found four sources that prefer a capital T and two which do not. I'm also ponderingFile:Justice Inc 1975.jpg which indicates that "The" is an inseparable part of the name. Appreciating thoughts either way,HidingT16:25, 23 September 2012 (UTC)[reply]

The Simpsons is the name of a TV show.The Phantom is the name of a comic strip.

One could say "The Joker" (Joker (comics)), "The Hulk"Hulk (comics), "The Spirit"Spirit (comics)) have "The" an inseparable part of the name, except that, like "The Avenger," they don't —The Bronx andThe Hague, nowthey have "The" as an inseparable part of their names. (The article title"The Shadow" refers not to the radio show but ti the character, so that article title vios the MOS as noted atWP:NCC/THE.)

I'm not sure I see what makes the Avenger different from theLone Ranger, theGreen Hornet, theX-Men, theFlash (comics), thePunisher, theTerminator (character), Butch Cassidy and theSundance Kid, even theAvengers (comics). How is the Avenger different from all those? --Tenebrae (talk)18:08, 23 September 2012 (UTC)[reply]

The Simpsons is the name of a TV show.The Phantom is the name of a comic strip.

• The Avenger looks to be the name of the character, based on the image linked to above and some four sources. I'm turning this over in my mind, and thinking of instances where Batman was referred to as the Batman, and those are quite clearly established and it is noted that the character has been referred to as The Batman, and I'm also thinking of how we refer to Simpsons creator Matt Groening. So I am noting that these things require some thought. Is Lone Ranger at the wrong place? How often was Sundance Kid referred to as just Sundance? Does the film title Terminator influence usage, or the fact that there is more than one? It's all about usage, isn't it?Avengers is an easy one, that's the publication name. (Curiously it springs to mind that for most of my youth it wasThe Fantastic Four, but that's maybe one to put on the back-burner for future times and minds?) Hulk has referred to himself and been referred to in the comics and films simply as Hulk. Joker is a good point though. I would argue the character has similarly had familiarity bred into the concept; I can recall instances where Batman has been written referring to the character simply as Joker; has The Avenger? From what tradition did The Avenger spring? The pulp tradition, where The Whatever was style of the day. Has The Avenger fallen into familiarity like Joker? I don't think so. Another example spring, to mind, that of The Saint, always referred to with The. I'm puzzling over solutions. We could rewrite the article to make the main focus the series? But I still think this is an instant where the character is referred to with the as an inseparable part of the name in almost all relevant material out there. I think that's the basis for the discussion, personally.HidingT11:05, 24 September 2012 (UTC)[reply]

I'm not sure the Old Time Radio program "The Avenger" should be mentioned here. From what I can tell, the Avenger of that show is an entirely different character.--G.B. Blackrock (talk)23:41, 20 March 2009 (UTC)[reply]

From the description in the article, it appears that there was more than one Avenger series. I know the one you're thinking of, and that series is pretty much a clone of The Shadow. The main character's name is Jim Brandon, and he has a female companion named Fern Collier. Instead of hypnosis, though, this Avenger uses a "diffusion capsule" to make himself invisible. He even had a reworked version of The Shadow's catchphrase: "The road to crime ends in a trap that Justice sets. Crime does not pay."24.57.229.254 (talk)02:36, 12 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Offhand I'm not seeing how to make the article title non-italic. There doesn't seem to be an "italic title" template on the page that one could remove. Anyone have any ideas? --Tenebrae (talk)19:39, 31 October 2012 (UTC)[reply]

There is now another Avenger character,Avenger (comics), so this could no longer be "Avenger (character)". --Tenebrae (talk)18:29, 31 August 2015 (UTC)[reply]

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The Kyle Baker miniseries may or may not be called a flight of fancy,as it diverges heavily from the known origin. "Black Ops" American spy groups are eager to recruit Benson as an operative, but he turns them down cold---he's a man with a family.

So an official named Grayle arranges the "accidental death" of Benso's family in t he plane incident.Benson is increasingly aware of this,but Grayle is well protected. In the early 1950's,during t he politically volatile McCarthy era; Benson's team leaves him one by one and becomes heavily right-wing,with some obeying orders to kill him.Josh is the only member who stays by Benson's side to the end. Benson finally kidnaps and murders Grayle---then disguises himself and takes Grayle's place in the intelligence community;swearing to undo all the wrongs Grayle committed during his career.— Precedingunsigned comment added by198.23.5.10 (talk)18:52, 12 June 2025 (UTC)[reply]

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