Talk:Kumbaya
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Also spelled kum ba yah, cumbayah, kumbayah, and probably a few other ways. If you look in a good songbook you'll find the word helpfully translated as "come by here," with the note that the song is "from Angola, Africa." The "come by here" part I'll buy. But Angola? Someone's doubtin', Lord, for the obvious reason that kumbaya is way too close to English to have a strictly African origin. More likely, I told my assistant Jane, it comes from some African-English pidgin or creole--that is, a combination of languages. (A pidgin is a linguistic makeshift that enables two cultures to communicate for purposes of trade, etc.; a creole is a pidgin that has become a culture's primary language.) Sure enough, when we look into the matter, we find this conjecture is on the money. Someone's grinnin', Lord, kumbaya.
Kumbaya apparently originated with the Gullah, an African-American people living on the Sea Islands and adjacent coastal regions of South Carolina and Georgia. (The best known Sea Island is Hilton Head, the resort area.) Having lived in isolation for hundreds of years, the Gullah speak a dialect that most native speakers of English find unintelligible on first hearing but that turns out to be heavily accented English with other stuff mixed in. The dialect appears in Joel Chandler Harris's "Uncle Remus" stories, to give you an idea what it sounds like. In the 1940s the pioneering linguist Lorenzo Turner showed that the Gullah language was actually a creole consisting of English plus a lot of words and constructions from the languages of west Africa, the Gullahs' homeland. Although long scorned as an ignorant caricature of English, Gullah is actually a language of considerable charm, with expressions like (forgive my poor attempt at expressing these phonetically) deh clin, dawn (literally "day clean"); troot mout, truthful person ("truth mouth"), and tebble tappuh, preacher ("table tapper").
And of course there's kumbayah. According to ethnomusicologist Thomas Miller, the song we know began as a Gullah spiritual. Some recordings of it were made in the 1920s, but no doubt it goes back earlier. Published versions began appearing in the 1930s. It's believed an American missionary couple taught the song to the locals in Angola, where its origins were forgotten. The song was then rediscovered in Angola and brought back here in time for the folksinging revival of the 50s and 60s. People might have thought the Gullahs talked funny, but we owe them a vote of thanks. Can you imagine sitting around the campfire singing, "Oh, Lord, come by here"?—The precedingunsigned comment was added by216.85.53.66 (talk •contribs) 20:11, 31 August 2006.
See[1].WP accused of being wrong. Research and possibly modify article?Zora17:25, 13 November 2006 (UTC)[reply]
The article declares the song to be copyrighted after providing details that logically imply that it isnot protected by copyright. The claim should be revised or removed. —SlamDiego16:35, 24 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]
Kumbayah IS roots music, so importance should be high. Maybe it should be a B class, but it needs a little work.Pustelnik (talk)02:19, 22 November 2007 (UTC)[reply]
I don't think so. I'll give this a month to be documented, or I will delete it.Pustelnik (talk)02:57, 1 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]
How would you like this "documented"? Neo-Aramaic 101? (Izady (talk)23:05, 13 February 2008 (UTC)Izady)[reply]
is this an aramiac idiom? were is it used? in the talmud?—Precedingunsigned comment added by4.239.42.208 (talk)23:46, 3 June 2008 (UTC)[reply]
1st voice: Combea tecum ("Keep my blessings with you" = "goodbye to you") 2nd voice: Combea! 1st voice: Combea mecum ("And share some blessing with me" = "goodbye from me") 2nd voice: Combea!This is interesting to me. Was researching the Inquisition in Portugal many years ago. One of the accusations against a woman who was tried was that her and two other women, at the execution of a man who was found guilty of heresy, began singing "audi fletus mei combea". We briefly tried to find a song by that title (I think they spent a couple weeks calling around) but without luck. After reading this comment, I wonder if this would be verses of the song they were singing and not a title. At this point, it's not useful for us as we were researching these about 10 years ago.71.33.152.113 (talk)11:49, 25 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Are you sure that Latin is really the most likely language of origin for this phrase? "Kum by ya," as-is, is a Gullah/Krio/Sea Islands Creole phrase which could literally be translated "come by here." Since the song apparently originates among speakers of an English-African creole, wouldn't this explanation make more sense?messor (talk)16:28, 6 May 2014 (UTC)[reply]
Please consider expanding on this sentence, giving specific examples, fixing any grammar/mechanics errors, and doing the appropriate references. Thank you.
~Anonymous—Precedingunsigned comment added by98.197.211.243 (talk)03:55, 20 November 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Yes, someone should try to expand on the derogatory use of "Let's all join hands and sing Kumbaya" - since this is one of the more popular uses of Kumbaya.—Precedingunsigned comment added by41.140.144.2 (talk)23:26, 12 November 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Just an observation: "Kumbaya" can be homophonous with northern English pronunciations of "come by here." Speakers of certain English dialects don't pronounce their Hs (while still saying 'heich' or 'hah-eech' to say the actual letter), as well as their Rs. As an example, people from Hull say "beeyah" for "beer," and say "hee-yah" for "here." In the Cockney accent they say "'orse" for "horse," etc.
"Kumbaya" might be a bastardized spelling "come by here," just like it has been done for other words that African Americans are supposed to have used, such as "massah," "wid," and "hoss" for "master, "with," and "horse" respectively.
Therefore, to me, "Kumbayah" just sounds like "come by here" the way someone whose accent doesn't say Hs or Rs might say it: "come by 'eyah"
There is a Medieval Latin explanation above, but that sounds a little farfetched, seeing as it doesn't make sense that a missionary would teach a song in Latin to anyone, much less a song in Latin mixed with English (my lord?). Perhaps the "combea" happens to be a cognate for the bastardization of "come by here?" A madrigal might not have much complex chords, but the phrasing doesn't seem to that of one.
It makes more sense that "kumbaya" is a deliberate bastardization of "come by here," probably used to belittle its singers (or the singers it's supposed to portray), much like the song "Massa's in de Cold, Cold Ground."KogeJoe (talk)02:18, 15 December 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Are song references of interest for this article? For example the "Mittermeier vs. Guano Babes" nu metal song "kumba yo!".—Precedingunsigned comment added by217.91.121.14 (talk)10:36, 21 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]
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I know people referring to the song in a mocking fashion isn't a new phenomenon, but should I actually include the latest example, or is it not notable enough?I was thinking of putting in the below:
HoboMcJoe (talk)23:30, 25 March 2015 (UTC)[reply]
References
Seems like the "references in..." sections are just miscellaneous trivia masquerading as useful information.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Manual_of_Style/Trivia_sections
also
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia_talk:Avoid_trivia
184.186.80.103 (talk)19:48, 2 February 2016 (UTC)[reply]
The fourth column of the Lyrics table was added in one day, first by an anonymous IP address, reverted, then by a user that only ever did that one edit.https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:Contributions/Boergelau
This seems to be a non-notable version of the song, only referenced by a YouTube video that plays a version of the song by singer Helmut Lotti, with lyrics apparently added by him.
I propose deleting this column, and will do so if nobody objects.Whesse (talk)09:52, 21 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]
